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Is It A Bribe or a Tip?


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2 hours ago, Davybe said:

From the online Oxford Dictionary??

Or Tips "To insure Person service "

I would assume they had some drinks served before giving any money ,but we will never know....Davybe 

The definition i have heard is "to insure prompt service" - although I think "ensure" would be more appropriate.  I have also heard that this is a myth, invented after the fact.

I am not concerned about how, when or why people spend their money.  We always leave auto gratuities in place and rarely tip any more.  I find a smile and pleasant words go a long way towards getting good service compared with passengers who are demanding and treat the staff like their personal servants.

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I wonder if it works in the casino???  If it does I'm in!!

Interesting If you want to dump your monies and prove how wealthy or ignorant you are then go for it . As long as service to me is professional and a reasonable wait period,  a non issue Man

What anyone else does with auto gratuities or whether they tip in advance to get better service is nothing to do with you and none of your business.

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6 hours ago, Davybe said:

From the online Oxford Dictionary??

Or Tips "To insure Person service "

I would assume they had some drinks served before giving any money ,but we will never know....Davybe 

Wondered how long it would be for this 'urban myth' to rear it's ungrammatical head.

To make proper sense in grammatical English it should be ENSURE. You INSURE against something happening, ie accident, travel delay etc. The opposite of what that myth is meant to be saying.

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I don’t see who,when,where you tip a member of the crew is a bribe, at the start of a cruise, and a tip at the end,on land base holidays tipping the pool boy at the start of your holiday, gets you a sun bed in the sun and your looked after.

I don’t tip at the start of a cruise, but if other do, good luck to them, it is all personal choice at the end ofthe day

 

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10 hours ago, Davybe said:

And What principle would that be HLM?

And I do wonder what that senior crew member would do,The Tips make up a large part of their wages why would they not accept a cash tip part way or at the start of the cruise, nothing as far as I can see illegal about it....Davybe

Nothing illegal at all, however if some pax get preferential treatment because they've decided to tip upfront then I'd be well within my rights to withhold any tips that I would've given. Crew can carry on taking them because ultimately they'll save me money, as I can assure you if I saw it taking place my tip will stay in my pocket.

HLM.

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1 hour ago, Jenjen said:

I don’t see who,when,where you tip a member of the crew is a bribe, at the start of a cruise, and a tip at the end,on land base holidays tipping the pool boy at the start of your holiday, gets you a sun bed in the sun and your looked after.

I don’t tip at the start of a cruise, but if other do, good luck to them, it is all personal choice at the end ofthe day

 

You start off by saying it doesnt matter when you tip whether at the start or at the end so it isnt a bribe and then you admit tip the pool boy at the start of your holiday and that then guarantees you a sun bed in the sun. So in effect you are bribing the pool boy to get you a decent sun bed.

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4 hours ago, HLM said:

Nothing illegal at all, however if some pax get preferential treatment because they've decided to tip upfront then I'd be well within my rights to withhold any tips that I would've given. Crew can carry on taking them because ultimately they'll save me money, as I can assure you if I saw it taking place my tip will stay in my pocket.

HLM.

I’m sure someone who is looking for a reason to withhold tips can find one........

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7 hours ago, smtcan said:

I’m sure someone who is looking for a reason to withhold tips can find one........

Meaning what? If you're suggesting that I'm looking for excuses to withhold then you're way off.

I've never looked for reason to withhold tips, but if it stared me in the face like crew taking bribes then I'd have no problem keeping my money in my pocket, if people are openly honest so would they.

In my opinion anyone who openly bribes the crew on the first day in order to get better service are pretty sad, not only that I think it's rather demeaning and disrespectful not only to the crew but other passengers.

HLM.

 

Edited by HLM
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18 hours ago, smtcan said:

The definition i have heard is "to insure prompt service" - although I think "ensure" would be more appropriate.  I have also heard that this is a myth, invented after the fact.

I am not concerned about how, when or why people spend their money.  We always leave auto gratuities in place and rarely tip any more.  I find a smile and pleasant words go a long way towards getting good service compared with passengers who are demanding and treat the staff like their personal servants.

I agree we've never tipped beforehand. I like to think we are both pleasant and friendly. I've also found that if you frequent somewhere like the Crow's nest for a pre-dinner drink the staff get to know you and we've never been kept waiting. I'd have no objection if someone gave a tip beforehand that's up to them.

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5 hours ago, Oldworldtraveller said:

In reality, does it really matter. Surely it is up to the individual what they do and nothing to do with anyone else. Personally I  go on holiday to relax, chill out, enjoy myself, not worry about if someone is giving a tip to anyone. However, as always, just my opinion.

It would matter to me if I'd been waiting patiently to get served only for someone too in effect to 'jump the queue' and get served just because they've given an incentive/bribe to a crew member.

I like yourself like to chill out and relax whilst on holiday but somethings would irritate me and this would be one.

HLM.

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On 8/2/2018 at 6:52 AM, HLM said:

Meaning what? If you're suggesting that I'm looking for excuses to withhold then you're way off.

I've never looked for reason to withhold tips, but if it stared me in the face like crew taking bribes then I'd have no problem keeping my money in my pocket, if people are openly honest so would they.

In my opinion anyone who openly bribes the crew on the first day in order to get better service are pretty sad, not only that I think it's rather demeaning and disrespectful not only to the crew but other passengers.

HLM.

 

I think you made that suggestion yourself in a previous postHLM. 

I doubt very much that any tips given at any stage of the cruise would be broadcast ,or done openly.

The reality is that if the crew know you as a tipper, from previous cruises ,they will give you a bit better service .if your known and a tight wad why would they rush to serve you....Davybe

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The guys on the ships are employed to do a job, if we are inefficient at work we risk getting fired. If the guys on the ships are below par the tips that they get, whether through the passengers who reduce them or the questionnaire, may loose out on what they get and possibly get a warning. They are employed to do a good job as are we.

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41 minutes ago, Davybe said:

I think you made that suggestion yourself in a previous postHLM. 

I doubt very much that any tips given at any stage of the cruise would be broadcast ,or done openly.

The reality is that if the crew know you as a tipper, from previous cruises ,they will give you a bit better service .if your known and a tight wad why would they rush to serve you....Davybe

The original suggestion was that people are looking for reasons to withhold tips, which is not something I'd be doing.

In reply I actually said, that if I saw this type of behaviour occurring I'd certainly keep my money in my pocket and rightly so, and I stand by that. This being totally different to making excuses not to pay anything as the other post suggests.

Just to add, how could one be known as a "tightwad" if one doesn't openly broadcast their tipping preferences?

HLM.

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Never see Carnival plc openly admit to being a "tightwad" employer in paying their staff very poorly and give them the hope that they will receive better wages because of the tips that are given by cruisers who are brainwashed into paying such tips because of that reason and being made to feel guilty and how hard they worked. I worked for over 30yrs very hard in an emergency service and not once got or expected a tip thats what I was paid for to work hard.

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3 hours ago, sinbad10 said:

Never see Carnival plc openly admit to being a "tightwad" employer in paying their staff very poorly and give them the hope that they will receive better wages because of the tips that are given by cruisers who are brainwashed into paying such tips because of that reason and being made to feel guilty and how hard they worked. I worked for over 30yrs very hard in an emergency service and not once got or expected a tip thats what I was paid for to work hard.

Totally agree with you Sinbad and, for the last 20 years that we have been cruising, we have paid up because it seemed the right thing to do.  I fully accept that we passengers do need to pay the wages of all the staff, but as more people are now removing the auto grats I no longer feel comfortable with them being discretionary.  So very reluctantly I will no longer pay the auto grats, I have messaged P&O to say why,and that until they make them compulsory, or include them in the fare, I will only tip if I feel the service has truly been excellent. I will probably do the same if I have cruises on other lines that have discretionary gratuities.

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I really don't want to get into a 'tipping' discussion again but I do think that working in emergency services although of course extremely admirable I'm sure tips wouldn't be expected. However in the service industry I believe tips to be the norm. That said having only cruised with P&O and have got to know some staff really well, I've often wondered if they discuss passengers with other members of staff. I think they must and I'm fairly sure they probably tell each other who are perhaps 'good' tippers and who aren't. Or is it just that they really do like some people and not others. I like to think the staff we have become friendly with like us because we are friendly people and not for any other reason.

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11 hours ago, Tally said:

I really don't want to get into a 'tipping' discussion again but I do think that working in emergency services although of course extremely admirable I'm sure tips wouldn't be expected. However in the service industry I believe tips to be the norm. That said having only cruised with P&O and have got to know some staff really well, I've often wondered if they discuss passengers with other members of staff. I think they must and I'm fairly sure they probably tell each other who are perhaps 'good' tippers and who aren't. Or is it just that they really do like some people and not others. I like to think the staff we have become friendly with like us because we are friendly people and not for any other reason.

A few years ago there was what was referred to as the spit list(Don't ask) where when the crew found out who had removed their tips and sought revenge? In the USA they will ask you why no tip was the service bad?

I personally never thought this existed ,but you could never be sure.

We tip when dinning out locally and was quite surprised  how waiting staff do remember the people who tipped them.

It would seem that cruisers want the traditional service they got, but do not wish to do the traditional tipping....Davybe

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21 hours ago, sinbad10 said:

Never see Carnival plc openly admit to being a "tightwad" employer in paying their staff very poorly and give them the hope that they will receive better wages because of the tips that are given by cruisers who are brainwashed into paying such tips because of that reason and being made to feel guilty and how hard they worked. I worked for over 30yrs very hard in an emergency service and not once got or expected a tip thats what I was paid for to work hard.

But then again you were not expecting any tips were you? As it stands ships front of house crew rely on the tipping system to make ups large percentage of their pay....Davybe

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10 minutes ago, Davybe said:

It would seem that cruisers want the traditional service they got, but do not wish to do the traditional tipping....

But it's not traditional tipping is it Davybe, traditionally tips were given personally with the cruiseline having nothing to do with it, now the cruiseline use 'auto grats' so they can increase their profit by reducing crew salaries, and then try to make out they are doing us a favour!!!!.

Nothing traditional about that.

HLM.

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1 hour ago, Davybe said:

But then again you were not expecting any tips were you? As it stands ships front of house crew rely on the tipping system to make ups large percentage of their pay....Davybe

Yes but why do they expect tips it is because the cruise companies pay them so poorly but then tell them you will get fantastic wages because of the tips that cruisers pay and then the cruise companies brainwash cruisers into feeling guilty because they are paid so poorly, but dont admit that, then you pay tips. Total hypocrisy and then the companies make billions of pounds profit by paying poor wages and then cruisers pay it.

Edited by sinbad10
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12 hours ago, Tally said:

I really don't want to get into a 'tipping' discussion again but I do think that working in emergency services although of course extremely admirable I'm sure tips wouldn't be expected. However in the service industry I believe tips to be the norm. That said having only cruised with P&O and have got to know some staff really well, I've often wondered if they discuss passengers with other members of staff. I think they must and I'm fairly sure they probably tell each other who are perhaps 'good' tippers and who aren't. Or is it just that they really do like some people and not others. I like to think the staff we have become friendly with like us because we are friendly people and not for any other reason.

Sorry but you are living in cloud cuckoo land they are not friendly because they like you or want to become friends it is because you pay good tips and that is all they are interested in making as much money as possible.

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1 hour ago, Davybe said:

A few years ago there was what was referred to as the spit list(Don't ask) where when the crew found out who had removed their tips and sought revenge? In the USA they will ask you why no tip was the service bad?

I personally never thought this existed ,but you could never be sure.

We tip when dinning out locally and was quite surprised  how waiting staff do remember the people who tipped them.

It would seem that cruisers want the traditional service they got, but do not wish to do the traditional tipping....Davybe

There is a current situation on Princess cruises Facebook page where a coupleon returning to their cabin they found their toothbrushes in a filthy disgusting state covered in a brown substance. Photographs were shown as proof and was reported immediately to reception and is ongoing. By coincidence the cruisers had removed auto gratuity and as the cabin steward was the only other person to have access to the cabin makes you wonder about what the substance is and how it got there. I believe the person has also made a complaint direct to Princess as well as reception.

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33 minutes ago, sinbad10 said:

There is a current situation on Princess cruises Facebook page where a coupleon returning to their cabin they found their toothbrushes in a filthy disgusting state covered in a brown substance. Photographs were shown as proof and was reported immediately to reception and is ongoing. By coincidence the cruisers had removed auto gratuity and as the cabin steward was the only other person to have access to the cabin makes you wonder about what the substance is and how it got there. I believe the person has also made a complaint direct to Princess as well as reception.

Well that seems to me to be a very good reason to leave the Auto gratuities in place.😱

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6 hours ago, sinbad10 said:

Sorry but you are living in cloud cuckoo land they are not friendly because they like you or want to become friends it is because you pay good tips and that is all they are interested in making as much money as possible.

Sorry but you are wrong. Let me give you an example. We had a really delightful waiter called Rudolpho on our world cruise in 2015. We next saw him in New Orleans in 2016 when we were on the Oceana. He didn't know we were on the ship and we didn't know he was. When he saw us walking towards him he gave me a huge hug. Why would he do that because he wasn't our waiter on that cruise, so would not be getting a tip from us, and yet he was delighted to see us. I could give other examples. You seem to have a very jaded view of life which is a shame. 

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